Posts by Island Man

24

Why it's a waste of time talking to JW's

by Phizzy in

i believe it to be a waste of time talking to, reasoning with, jw's if you expect any kind of quick result.. many of us when we first wake up think that 'coz ttatt is blindingly obvious to us, it will soon get through to our jw loved ones.. this simply isn't so for a couple of important reasons.

the first is that, if someone believes something is true, or the truth, to them it really is, without doubt, true.

so whatever you say must be wrong somehow.. the second problem is that jw's simply do not have to use, or pay any attention to facts and logic.

Island Man

I disagree. I think it can seem like a waste of time if you have unrealistic expectations.

Sharing TTATT with JWs does have a deep impression on them even though they may not show it outwardly or act on it immediately. Seeds of reason are planted which may spring up and grow years later when the circumstances are right. It is those seeds that may make the difference in helping a JW to exit when (s)he faces a crisis of faith or adversity brought on by the organization itself.

TTATT is not a block that brakes the camel's back. It's just bales of straw that weigh down the camel's back one step closer to its breaking point.

21

Picture of Stephen Lett in 1976!

by Iamallcool in

jw
friends

https://macsdowell.files.wordpress.com/2015/04/1976-9-17-new-bethelites.jpg.

Island Man

I agree with jookbeard, it doesn't look like him at all.

61

Demon possesion, bunch of crap or?

by raven in

i've been using the forum to vent and post a lot more frequently lately as a venting purpose & way to obtain peace of mind with the craziness i've been going through recently as i fade away form the org.

anyways today i'm sitting here at work and thinking to myself about demons... ok i know this sounds crazy but has anyone else out there been traumatized by the thought of demons?

i had a dream the other night, just flat out spooky and i woke and couldn't help but feeling it may have been evil ole' satan and his demons at it again.. i don't want to believe that, (trying not to, & just brushing it under the rug so to speak) but have any of you out there been talked up about demons?

Island Man

Meh Crofty,
There might be an alternate dimension that bleeds into this one at times. Who knows for certain?

Meh Lieu,

There might be an invisible pink elephant floating around in your room at times. Who knows for certain? LOL

61

Demon possesion, bunch of crap or?

by raven in

i've been using the forum to vent and post a lot more frequently lately as a venting purpose & way to obtain peace of mind with the craziness i've been going through recently as i fade away form the org.

anyways today i'm sitting here at work and thinking to myself about demons... ok i know this sounds crazy but has anyone else out there been traumatized by the thought of demons?

i had a dream the other night, just flat out spooky and i woke and couldn't help but feeling it may have been evil ole' satan and his demons at it again.. i don't want to believe that, (trying not to, & just brushing it under the rug so to speak) but have any of you out there been talked up about demons?

Island Man

I think demon possession is superstitious rubbish thought up by ancient people who were unable to explain mental illnesses. Remember, there was a time when people did not know that the brain is responsible for our thoughts and actions. They thought that there was a separate inanimate being inhabiting the body - a "ghost in the machine", if you will.

So when presented with mental people who were having auditory hallucinations and split personality disorders, and behaving violently or irrationally, they would naturally think that there must be another "ghost in the machine" - that the person's body is possessed.

However, by the time science finally figured out the brain's role in thought, action and mental illness, the idea of demons and demon-possession had already taken firm hold in religions and had become inextricably entwined with religious beliefs and the sacred writings they're based on. So people still held on to the superstitious idea of demons and demon possession even though science had already provided an answer for behavior of those said to be possessed.

So I believe that ignorance of the brain's functioning and malfunctioning led to the development of the idea of possession by spirits. And once this idea became a part of sacred religious beliefs and texts, loyalty to these said sacred religious beliefs preserved and perpetuated this false idea of demon possession long after science has presented a reasonable and logical explanation.

16

CHILD BAPTISM

by megabyte_vijay in

it is strange to read the last week watchtower that encouraging child/teenagers' baptism.

even jesus was baptised as his 30. jws encouraging marriages at an older age.

but why they are encouraging children to get baptised.

Island Man

I found it very funny that they used Ephesians 4:14 in a study article seeking to justify child baptism. The text says:

So we should no longer be children, tossed about as by waves and carried here and there by every wind of teaching+ by means of the trickery of men, by means of cunning in deceptive schemes

Do you see it? The text likens immature, gullible christians to children. If the bible would use children as a metaphor for the spiritual immaturity that christians are to avoid then how could they be saying that children are mature enough to make such a responsible, life-shaping decision? How can they be saying that children are mature enough and are making the decision of baptism of their own full volition and aren't merely being 'tossed by waves and carried by the wind of influence' of their parents and other adults that they look up to?

They are utterly blind to use that text in their study article and not see the contrary implications of it.

5

What is the "Social Currency" for witnesses?

by stuckinarut2 in

jw
friends

while flying recently for work, i overheard a conversation about the "social currency" that people in the community or workplace have.. for example, a manager or boss yields more power (obviously) over those below him or her.. but one person observed that other factors have value.

for example a parent may have more value in some circles, while being childless may help in others.. looks or how someone carries themselves may also give value.. so it made me think, what is the social currency amongst witnesses?

what gives them power, status, validation or value?.

Island Man

Field service time.

12

Possible Names For New XJW Books...

by JW_Rogue in

just what it sounds like list some titles that you think would be good for an xjw memoir or book.

just for fun:.

-the real, real life.

Island Man

"Hello World!"

An autobiography chronicling the life of a JW struggling to balance his passion for his career as a programmer with the JW philosophy of putting kingdom interests first and not seeking great things in the world. "Hello World!" is the very cliche first programming project that every student of programming does. But "hello world!" is also what the ex-JW says in his heart as he finally discards the shackles of JW programming and reintegrates back into the "world" that he once vilified as a brainwashed JW.

150

I'm getting baptized

by BlackWolf in

jw
friends

i know i've started similar topics before but this time i'm serious.

my parents have been constantly pressuring me and after yesterday's watchtower study they asked me if i was going to be baptized this summer... and i said yes.

i probably should have thought about it more before making a final decision, but they're pretty much forcing me to do it anyway.

Island Man

Thank you all for your advice. I know you mean well but its too late to go back now, I've already told them I'm going to do it.

No, it's not too late. You have to go through questions with the elders. You can just flunk the questions so that the elders say you're not ready yet. Better yet, you can make it known to the elders that you're only getting baptized to please your parents because they're pressuring you. Then the elders will say you're not qualified and you'll be off the hook. Your parents can't blame you if you fail to qualify due to the fact that they are the ones pushing and pressuring you.

160

Beliefs About What Caused the Universe

by Perry in

the universe can be observed to be expanding.. an expanding universe must have had a beginning.

whatever begins to exist had a cause.

therefore the universe had a cause.

Island Man

Doesn't imply a Causer? What kind of a beginning doesn't have a cause?

Perry, the only beginnings you have experience with are beginnings within time and space. You have no experience with beginnings outside of time and space. So I'm not sure that it's logical to assume that beginnings outside of time and space require a cause the same as beginnings within time and space.

160

Beliefs About What Caused the Universe

by Perry in

the universe can be observed to be expanding.. an expanding universe must have had a beginning.

whatever begins to exist had a cause.

therefore the universe had a cause.

Island Man

A. Imagining things coming into existence without a cause
B. Imagining a first cause existing beyond our cause and effect (space/time) universe

It is actually more plausible to consider that the universe in some state, always existed. The expansion of space does not necessarily point to an origin of the existence of the universe. It only proves that the universe in its current state is expanding. It is possible that the singularity from which the universe expanded is eternal. Maybe the universe oscillates between expanding and contracting back to its singularity only to expand again.

It is far more plausible that the eternal source of the universe is a very natural and very simple entity than the complex, super-intelligent being that you are putting forward. So saying that there must be an eternally pre-existing first cause does not naturally and logically lead to the idea that that first cause is a complex, super-intelligent person. A very simple non-intelligent, non-conscious, inanimate entity is far more plausible. Have you heard of Occam's Razor?